A genuine business purpose enabled Riz Syed to open 30 brow threading bars (and he’s only just begun) | #397

Riz

India. I was born and bred in India but was my city. So yeah. Those are all my memories as i grew up so that’s how I came across threading. Threading is very commonly used in Middle East, Israel, Egypt and so on. So, it’s still very practiced. 3000 years old, I don’t know much about the history but who knows, you know. It’s a very, very ancient still running, still amazing, natural amazing technique. So, I knew this firsthand as growing up.

Tim

Why has it taken so long to come to Australia?

Riz

Possibly waiting for me. I would like to think. People have started here but I think that when my purpose of this is let’s start there that will kind of makes sense. Look I grew up in a business environment. My dad was a businessman and my brother followed him and he is into business. I grew up into business and security that’s the everyday normal process for me. So that’s my new life and I thought business was a very chaotic thing. But this is how it was run in India so that’s what I felt and I thought I could do a good education and I’d get a good job, I’ll do 95. And then after that life is sweet and what do you need from life. That’s what I thought. I’ve got it all figured, come back to Australia, start to do my degree, start a job and I very quickly find myself bored to death. Going is that it can’t be.

Tim

What was the degree

Riz

I did a Masters in Information Systems in South Australia

Tim

I love it yes. So already I love this story because you’ve got to do a masters in South Australia on information systems. I don’t even know what they are and now you writing an incredibly successful threading business. Well done to you.

Riz

So, it comes down to that. So, I came here to figure out that’s another thing to do and then my wife is also very anxious and masters in teaching French as a foreign language. She has worked for a very big language institution that is across the world. So, she is she is also business oriented. She doesn’t come from a business background but she always was keen to do more and learn more and do things. So, we both come together and we’re thinking Hey we could do something. But the purpose has to be right and the purpose purely for me and my wife was it has to be genuine, has to add value to people’s lives, and it has to be to as good health and good practices and we want to change or bring those things to our society because Australia is such an amazing country. Only one thing I tell you about Australia other as love is called freedom. It’s freedom and so you can absolutely go at anything. Nobody people are so supportive and helpful here that I find that I couldn’t possibly have the same environment in India and I love it and I really felt I could do something here I could give back for what I receive.

Tim

So, I love this so at some point you and your wife have set down you go, “You know what the Masters bores me.” Your wife was looking for some kind of change away from working for the language school. Was there a kitchen table kind of meeting where you bounced around a whole lot of ideas?

Riz

Yes, we looked into several things. It wasn’t until my sister was in the U.S. has got several salons doing this exactly, rang me up and said I was saying this is what’s going on in my life. Why don’t you do what I do and I said What do you do? I’m sorry I never ask because I’ve got five sisters again to go into too much detail. So, this is what I do and you can come over and have a look. So, we went we had to look and we investigated around in pairs at around that time and there were some people offering threading but I understood one thing very, very important to him and that time that people will not just jump into something without knowing that you know especially something so prestigious like an eyebrow; you’re not just going to give it to somebody to do something new. Just like that. It is a big part of education.

Tim

I have never looked at my eyebrows as prestigious. I will look at myself differently.

Riz

Yes, if you look if you ask a woman and possibly that was the most important thing because it frames the face. And also, if people don’t understand it that way they will certainly understand if that were once they had trading done because of shape you’ll get how much value it will add to the features you already have. It’s a no brainer. Once you see that

Tim

So, you have gone over, your sister was living in the states is it correct that you went to visit and you and your wife have learnt or rediscovered I guess threading, the art of threading and going you know, what this takes a lot of boxes. You know you talked about purpose being it’s genuine, you know we’re going to be able to add value to people’s lives by having them improving I guess their confidence in the way they look. So you’ve come back here what did you do

Riz

I try every single place to get an opening, obviously it’s so alien I couldn’t even get insurance cover for it. There was just what you wanted to water again and we are covering that that’s not happening. It wasn’t until I found a South African guy on the phone who had a look his life would do this treatment in South Africa. I know what you’re talking about. Give me a minute I’m going to talk to my wife about this just before I cover you. I do want to help you because I think it was fantastic and my life will be a first line so great. I finally got to know really well. That’s where it all started so that the insurance all at different stages. It was difficult but certainly worth the while.

Tim

He was that South African fellow was he an insurance guy?

Riz

Yes.

Tim

Every business owner needs that person. I don’t mean insurance person but you know when you’re starting a business and it’s a new idea particularly I guess when it’s an idea that many people haven’t heard of, you we’ve somehow just got to find that one person that believes in what we’re doing, don’t we

Riz

Absolutely.

Tim

Is his wife still a client?

Riz

I believe so. But trying to dig things sorry, I’m too busy backstage

Tim

Ah, good idea. Well that’s why you’re here mate. Because I think it’s fascinating that you have got now 30 Zubias salons, threading salons throughout Perth. So before we get to 30, ’cause it is a question on my mind. How did you get a 30 and where are you going to be in two years time? But what was the first one, was it a market stall, was it a attachment to a hairdressing salon, what was it?

Riz

It was the salon that I’m most proud of. It was a part where, I could call it the salon and you could call it anything you call it Oh-then slammed kiosk.

Tim

Chaos or kiosk?

Riz

No, it wasn’t chaos. So, then we organize it quite nicely and very personal starts to partition from Ikea to toilet mirrors, you know the little ones I remember there were eight dollars each on the wall. That’s what I had and a 250-dollar rack in the middle of those like the shelves, so you can put the equipment. My personal laptop on top trying to display any videos I could find about turning because it couldn’t afford to have a formal one so I just put together what I could and two barber chairs I bought in the area for 250 each and ourselves presents as well, smiling with a laminated poster saying eyebrow threading. And all I had was myself, a thread, my wife was right next to me and all our intentions were focused on explaining to people what this is and let them decide. And get familiarise and comfortable and if they want to do this and every time we did and it comes from there and obviously after the proof is in the pudding that’s well they believe and they see that they understand it when they get to see the result. They spread the word now or with angst on that

Tim

But that was your challenge wasn’t it? Because you are new to a business, you are selling something that we don’t know what it is. I mean I’ve walked past threading places in Southland a shopping centre near where I live and I’m like, what is that? It’s a trend won’t be here next week anyway I won’t bother to understand it anymore. So clearly that’s not the case now. But it must have been something that you really had to work hard on the whole education process.

Riz

I took a lot of emotional beating. So, did my wife.

Tim

What do you mean?

Riz

I think out of it too. I coped better and I still do it because you have to stand in front. You can’t expect because it is so unique and so new, you have to invite people, you have to encourage them because generally people are shy what you don’t know you don’t want to know and generally stay away from it kind of thing. So, I had to be that person. So, my challenge here Tim is from India. So, I’ve got a fairly dark skin so it doesn’t, I don’t look like an average person that you find in Caucasian person in Australia. Not that it’s a good thing or a bad thing, just stating the different facts though and I’m a male and I’m in beauty and I’m selling something quite unique on a walkway open kiosk. So, there were plenty of challenges.

Tim

Tell me about it. What do you mean by the emotional beatings like where. Yeah. What does that mean

Riz

People who don’t actually understand what threading is. There will be quick to judge and they will make comments that oh my god then lifting the face with the thread or those oh my god that’s just wrong. And people actually in a sense is all I want to give you some knowledge it’s up to you if you don’t do it. But I would like one minute of your time if you knew me I would just like to explain to you and then I will get some answers which would not be pleasant but I kept stuck at it because all I’m looking for is that one person out of ten would be happy to listen and happy to learn. And that’s what I focused on always, always focused on those customers make my day.

Tim

Your wife didn’t handle the emotional beatings as well. Was there a moment back around the kitchen table where you kind of going maybe we’re not going to make this work

Riz

I never doubted it meant never from the day one from that phone conversation with my sister, I had my business set up.

Tim

What about your wife?

Riz

Had to get her to buy in. I’m good at that.

Tim

How?

Riz

Well I knew I couldn’t do it without her. Guarantee that, because I am a little bit like Lisa Conway in the sense I’ve got the drive, I’ve got the real power, and I can see the end straightaway and I can see the bigger picture. Obviously, I’m not greater detail which is my wife. She is brilliant at that. She is brilliant organiser. She can calculate, work out things, she can lay beautiful plans. So together are we unbeatable. And I knew that from the get go. So, I had to get a buy in from here and I showed her all the confidence in the world that I could say I will go on my own if I have to I’ll quit everything and I’ll do it. I seriously believe that we can make this happen. I had to paint that picture for her and she did come in and I’m so glad that she did and she doesn’t regret it for a bit. And we have built on our confidence together and we are solid team as ever can be.

Tim

As you were doing the sell on your wife, Riz, were you confident

Riz

Absolutely.

Tim

100 percent. Wasn’t gonna fail. So, what was the tipping point where all of a sudden, you’re heading towards your first 10 stores? Do we just backing yourself or did something happen that showed you that this is actually going to be pretty big?

Riz

In some ways I would like to think that we’re so big, what about those customers who are living in the remote area? They don’t deserve this service? No, I want to be close to them. I don’t want them to travel so much. So, my cell phones in WA you see, happen to look at a map and later down the track of like it goes some boundary to Tundula. That is nearly onto for trial. So, I do want to make it easier for the customer and make it readily available just because I can earn more money in a certain location and it’s not the point. The point is the customer and it’s my job as a business man to make it work in every area. So that’s what I focus on in the background.

Tim

Listeners we are talking to Riz Syed who is the founder owner chief everything officer CEO of Zuby as the threading in Perth. 30 stores. You have got quite a number of mostly company owned stores Riz, but you’re also starting to franchise

Riz

Yes, we have had quite a lot of amazing staff members. I’m all about people team cannot do it without my team. I swear by them and I put my heart and soul in them so they returned the same. So, I was very glad to have our first ever employee work through our time in W.A. work with me and she moved to Melbourne after that. For whatever reason and the second girl who I employed progress in our company. I’m talking the second girl in 2008 so she stuck around. She did a masters in accounting, did her dash and say you know what, I find so much satisfaction working in this company. I’m going to come back and say you know what. Give me a salon. A manager said I’ve done it. I know what to do and you I trust you. Let’s go. So why not go ahead. So, all my franchisees are my own staff who just wanted to upgrade their lifestyle and say you know, I have so much faith in the way it’s operated and the company itself the purpose that I want to sign up for it and I want to live my life doing this forever.

Tim

Your passion for people is really obvious. I speak to a lot of small business owners and if I ask them what’s their biggest plan point it’s attracting and retaining great people. What’s your secret

Riz

Those people are people whether it’s customers, whether they’re staff, they’re all core values as is a view. If you peel the layers that we are, we are as basic as a need we are as an animal. We like being carried, we like feeling secure, we like being looked after. We have the same emotions and if you trigger those things correctly, the right purpose in your heart. If you genuinely want to make a guest feel welcome it’s not hard. It’s really not. You don’t have to treat them with fancy stuff. You just have to treat them like a human being just as you would like to be shoot yourself and understand that. And if you can’t do certain things, just don’t blunt it, there shut the door or you say things on the difficulties I have. What would you do in this situation. People genuinely understand and care as much as you do and they get involved and you do things together and I like doing things together with my team I don’t like doing solo things.

Tim

So am I right in saying that this partner husband-wife combination is where you focus a lot on that side of the business, the big picture, the people, I’m guessing the marketing which we’ll talk about shortly and your wife focuses on product delivery service delivery

Riz

My wife is… Okay there is this thing, we’re going to touch on the market soon but she’s in charge head of the marketing. I love that topic which is strange because I’m starting to now realise very recently that I might actually be holding my marketing skills. I haven’t got into it. They give you a bit more detail than that little bit later on.

Tim

Now go for it. What are you holding back?

Riz [00:17:13] Okay. So, marketing to me was a website, a paper, a flyer, a brochure, or whatever it is. And that to me is all details and I’m not a person, so I stayed far away from it. And I said I thought it will always fell in my life’s category. But there is a bigger aspect to the marketing than recently understanding. Marketing is all about gathering right people as customers. I am all about people and I have indeed built this business by contributing enormous and now by doing marketing, not by paper, not by website, even though i have developed our own website at that time and it is here and the whole lot. I studied that thing every day. So done those things, I still do a little bit of that on the side. But I never felt that that’s where the marketing was at that time because specially, education is a big part and I can articulate that so much of the customers and my team how to train them to help them pass the message on to the customers. And so marketing to me is this a dynamic thing that happens between the relationship between you and the customers and you and your staff very importantly because those who are going to carry the message to your customers. You’re not good at these stuffs. Good luck because you only one and I’ve got 150 of my staff. I’m not good with them enough. I don’t have a good relationship and they don’t do things for the right reason then the message is going out wrongly and that’s it.

Tim

You know. The reality is I think what you’re touched on Riz is the fact that marketing is everything and everything is marketing so, you’re absolutely right to finally realize that it’s much greater than a website and a brochure and a menu of services and an ad in the local paper. I mean that’s why I always like to draw a pie chart. If you want to visualize marketing and that pie chart represents 100 percent marketing but a very, very tiny wedge are those things that you just mentioned. So, it’s just everything you’re doing. I mean the way you’re managing your clients, your staff, your communications, you know, just everything. So, it’s a good realisation and you probably should feel freer in having that realization.

Riz

Yeah it is just happening Tim. And I’m actually listening Lisa’s podcast this morning in the car

Tim

The interview I did with Lisa Conway?

Riz

Yes, the one that you did with Lisa Conway. And I thought to myself, Oh I’m so most like Lisa in so many levels. Believe it or not we have a similar journey in life. I even went and worked for ages like she did.

Tim

Do you think you underestimate or have you historically underestimated just what you’re capable of?

Riz

I think so yes. And it’s out thanks to Lisa ConWay.

Tim

She should’ve be here. We probably have to run her phone number now so I can contact Lisa bloody Conway.

Riz

Yeah, she is gold. She is gold.

Tim

She is gold. But tell me more about that backing yourself now. So, you’ve got this confidence that is going to win. My question is like, you’ve got 30 stores, why haven’t you got 300 stores and is that just around the corner?

Riz

There will be. What I’ve learned recently that is helping me achieve those goals is because the more the bigger the team got, the bigger the salon the business got, the busier I got in the background. Because no one person can ever take everything and I’m learning with the business every single day even today and I hope I never stop. So over time, looking after so many people getting them organised and managing them in the light they were leading them is the right word. I was struggling with so many people at the same time and keep the consistency of the customer with the message of the business and it didn’t happen until Lisa came into play. Then she helped me get some ordinance, some planning, some culture, business culture and she developed me as a leader. So that helped me autopilot a lot of things in the culture to help people understand what we’re doing and they get on with that and that gives me room to actually work on the business which is what’s happening right now. So that’s where I’m quite confident that next year, we should be doing in 2018. There should be some big movements involved now.

Tim

How many stores by the end of 2018?

Riz

Haven’t put that number yet.

Tim

Outside of Perth? Are you going national

Riz

Absolutely, yes. National would be great, yes and I do have some areas that landlords are yelling out for companies to be there as a present. So yes, they’re pretty interesting.

Tim

So, you’ve created Zubias threading and you’ve created a brand from scratch really. Are you finding that being absolutely consistent with what the way that brand presents itself across 30 stores soon to be however many hundred stores. Is that a challenge

Riz

It’s the biggest challenge anyone could face. When you are in your salon, one Salon to Salon, you are very quickly able to upgrade something or get rid of something you know a flyer or a brochure and tell them little things to bigger things, habits. If the staffers doing certain something a certain way and now we’ve changed that maybe find a better way of doing it.

Riz

Imagine that change in 30 salons that will happen at once that is a big check.

Tim

How do you maintain that brand consistency?

Riz

Communication and figuring out the ways that most effectively it works for you and your team together. And that’s the key. And if you can figure out how to most effectively and most efficiently communicate with the team, then you’re on to something.

Tim

What is your most efficient way of communicating with what is a big team now.

Riz

First of all, you need to have relationships that have clear messages. You cannot have multi directional messages where people can get. Keep it simple keep concise and make everyone understand why they’re there. Why are you coming to work and understand their wires because they might have their own purposes to be involved in. So, once you understand those who import the right kind of people then it’s your business that’s very important you start with the right ingredients. You have a half decent dish if you don’t start with the right ingredients, Good luck. It’s not gonna be good. Even one can fall out.

Tim

Yes. True. We’re talking with Riz Syed of Zubias threading. Riz, you have very interesting pricing model and pricing is one of those things that I know many business owners struggle with. You’ve got this offer where you have unlimited threading plus a few additional little bonuses from eight dollars a week. That seems smart it seems incredibly cheap. How has that gone for you

Riz

It’s really, really, really effective team and it actually helps the business generate revenue as it goes and also helps build the business. So, you keep loyal customers and reward them for being loyal. Your income revenue might be reduced a little bit but they’re coming in so we do lots of other things apart from just the eyebrows obviously. So, there’s a value in that. Plus, it attracts more people. We can focus on adding more people into our business and more customers into our business by giving those customers great value because they will go out and talk to people and people bring people. Busy salon brings more people, more customers. What are they doing that is so busy? You want to go and check it out. So, all of these things are non-tangible and there are certain tangible aspects as it grows the business so well that that extra value is limited for the loyal customers. It’s just a thank you to say that you’re going to stick around for us with up to six months, help our revenue, give it a quick surge, when the buy the membership which also helps. So, it all adds up. It’s a good business sense.

Tim

Another thing that you’re particularly passionate about I’ve seen a video that you’ve done it sits on YouTube. In fact, listeners put it in the show notes but it’s talking about it, it actually explains the Zubias experience using the five senses through the eyes of a customer which I don’t know why it’s there because it’s caught sort of maybe it’s for franchisees or to attract franchisees. But it’s quite clever and clearly customer experience is everything to you. What is the customer experience for someone looking to use Zubias for threading?

Riz

Firstly, a very… Giggling and so they don’t know how many people are going to end up watching these videos.

Tim

Millions. Millions. Well you know, you might be giggling. Let me just because I think what you’re thinking is oh it’s an amateur video and I did it a while back and I do it better this time. Is that what you’re, is that what you’re thinking

Riz

No, I’m very comfortable with it but I do think it’s pretty hilarious.

Tim

Yeah it was, it’s great. I mean I love its rawness, its naivete if you like, I think it’s beautiful. And it works, it gets the message across but what is, because customer’s experience is so important, do you have a mapped customer experience that you say to every person working for Zubias that they must adhere to?

Riz

Look I generally, a lot of girls come from different cultures here because threading, we have tried in the past to actually train some of the students from the school and try to get them, the Aussies, a chance. People who are coming from a background where threading was not their thing. They haven’t grown up with thread in the hands. Those are types of people I’m talking about in general. So, we did try to teach and coach some youngsters to see if he can generate their skills and interests into them into our business. But it happens that it didn’t work out so well as we thought. So, we end up having people who are grown up with this and generally end up being people from Iran, India, and Pakistan and so on. So then, we have an expression. I’m from India myself and a lot of girls we work with are from India as well. But in general, these group of people I guess, is reflecting God and that means a big deal for them, for the culture. Not only them. So, the easiest example they use, a customer is your guest. Put stop and let the brain run and do the job. So, it’s almost equal to God. So, you do everything to make sure you’re pleased and you greet them and I simply say they are paying your bill, my bill, everyone’s bill. So, we have to thank them and be grateful that they chose to come to our store.

Tim

What is what’s highlighted to me Riz, Aussie business owners are going to probably get the shits with me for me saying this but your Indian culture has brought with you a deep, deep respect for people and for the customer and for staff which may be and I could be wrong here. I don’t I’m just putting it out there, maybe we don’t see enough of, and maybe that’s the reason for your success.

Riz

Possibly possible. I’m a very people person and very work from my heart. So, I look for the same thing. I’ve given chance to people or the girls that are hired, we’re struggling to string two English letters, words together to form a sentence and I saw that they are genuine. It came through to me this analogy to because I’m good reader of people. That’s my passion. Because I understand people, so you know, what you’re very passionate, and very driven, only limitation of English. That’s nothing, you learn in no time. You’ve got plenty of support. All the other girls will help you around it and in no time, you’ll be fine. Just focus on doing these skills correctly and then are trained you teach everything. English will come. You’re going to live here that’s fine. So, I’ve given opportunities to so proudly I say that I’ve given opportunities to several of my girls who would have found it hard to fit into society and they are the hidden gems. There’s some girls are just so impressive.

Tim

Must be very rewarding for you Riz. What do you say to the business owner listening who is really who isn’t a people person, but who has staff and are going to be employing more staff. What tips do you have for them to be more like Riz

Riz

Being fair is a big deal. Being honest is a big deal. Doing what you say and seeing what you’re doing is a big deal. Never ever say anything that you don’t know not going to come true and think just like kids, really. I would never do that to my child, if I promise something it’s going to happen that’s it. Don’t make fake things and if they see that you’re consistent, and you keep putting good things in the good cookie jar, then you are allowed to access a bad cookie jar as out there do something naughty. You are able to tell them and they will take you like a champion because you are there. They know that you mean the best. It’s easy.

Tim

Yeah, it’s that classic, who wrote Seven Habits of Highly Effective People Steve uhm. Doesn’t matter. Famous business book should know the author but he talks about the emotional bank account in business and the emotional. But you know you’ve got to put a lot of deposits into the positive side of the bank account before you can withdraw the negative side. But it does work that way so it’s not

Riz

One thing I find like a lot of times. I could accuse myself of this but I’ve learned over time that you walk in your business, I know your heart and soul is in every rubric of this shop. You walk in, and you’re wanting this thing to be 100 percent okay. You walk and you go. That’s not right. That’s not right. That’s not right. That’s not that’s not right. What did you just walk into the shop with? What kind of energy, what kind of message? Everyone’s going to be like turtles hiding back. They walk in. I first smile and look at everybody, make a good connection and make bring in that positive energy. It only helps it overall brings more customers. Honestly, I don’t know what it is about positive energy it brings several customers. People get to the front lines. So, walk in, smile, connect with people. All of the other things whichever thing is not right in the salon is your fault as a leader because you might not have been clear enough so you focus on yourself. Take a hard look and see how I can communicate better and help them get better positively. Very good lesson I have learned that’s the biggest thing I can give you that builds your teams so strong that you’ll love it.

Tim

I can’t top that risk and I don’t think you can either. I want to congratulate you on having great success so far with the Zubias threading and look forward to hearing when you open that one hundredth salon. Thanks for sharing on the small business big marketing show.

Riz

Thank you so much for having me, Tim. Appreciate it.