Must-know tips to grow your salon business (or any retail business really) with Zing’s Lisa Conway | #386

Tim Reid:
Did you have one?

Lisa Conway:
No. I did a few and then I hated the flat top.

Tim Reid:
Oh yeah.

Lisa Conway:
It attracted the very OCD.

Tim Reid:
I did it. Get the role around.

Lisa Conway:
The rest was a shift her behaviour.

Tim Reid:
Yeah right. You grew up in a country town so you would run a few mullet’s at the age of 18. You get into hairdressing that was a fairly obvious career transition from a girl in a country town.

Lisa Conway:
No, not really. I left the country because I want to be a hairdresser. So what happened to me. I walked into Colin St. Elizabeth Street and I thought I’ll get a haircut. Hadn’t thought anything of it. And the way they treated me just changed my life right there and then I decided that’s it I want to be a hairdresser now because she was just gorgeous. This girl really cared about me. And I just thought wow imagine doing that for a living and helping people. And that was it and I went home I was working in aged care and I went home and took my job in and came back to Melbourne and became a hairdresser.

Tim Reid:
Just to be clear at the age of 18

Lisa Conway:
19.

Tim Reid:
You had that realisation? Boom! That’s what I call an epiphany.

Lisa Conway:
It was a huge one. I couldn’t stop looking at myself in the mirror all the way home thinking oh I’m actually I’m alright.

Tim Reid:
Was this Elizabeth Street hairdresser operating off a low base?

Lisa Conway:
I think it was a training school. It just took me awhile to get that idea. I couldn’t believe I’d never experienced that before. I was just told I had ordinary hair because it is wild and no one gave a shit.

Tim Reid:
So here’s our first lesson. I reckon is the pitch because there would be many business owners listening selling owners and everyone else. If someone says to a hairdresser, what do you do? They say I’m a hairdresser I cut hair.

Lisa Conway:
No, you don’t.

Tim Reid:
What’s your response to that?

Lisa Conway:
People come in at a number. It might be two or four and you raised the bar send amount 10. 10 out of 10 spinning around and happy. Make people feel good. It’s an incredible job.

Tim Reid:
It’s a great pitch.

Lisa Conway:
It’s a great job and people don’t get it. We can’t get people to join our industry.

Tim Reid:
Really?

Lisa Conway:
Oh it’s terrible.

Tim Reid:
I thought it was a highly competitive industry.

Lisa Conway:
No.

Tim Reid:
There’s a hairdresser in every corner.

Lisa Conway.
Yeah I know but they still can’t find staff and they’re working in ones and twos in my day 1984, they used to be groups of 10 and 12 and 15. It was buzzing like the cafe culture now used to be hairdressing.

Tim Reid:
It’s a ongoing problem no matter what type of industry the small business owner is in. It’s what you based from people. Attracting retaining people.

Lisa Conway:
Because they’re not leaders.

Tim Reid:
So, what we’re going to talk about I’m going to guess will help any business owner achieve the attraction and retention of great people. So you go back. I’m a 10 out of 10. I never look at me. I’m leaving aged care. I’m getting into hairdressing so for how many years did you cut hair before you started your own business.

Lisa Conway:
16. I worked for one man. He was a ribber paid me really well let me run the place and he was just awesome and I didn’t realise why he loved me I was a ripper of a team member I was until I started for my own that I thought oh no wonder Sam love me.

Tim Reid:
Pager well gave you enough rope to hang yourself?

Lisa Conway:
Flexibility. I think I was age 21. I said I can’t do five days a week that’s too hard to put your face on and be switched on. What if I did four. Does it do for you say money. I did four and that’s what people aren’t flexible today. I gave my managers Saturdays off because you want them to have something that no one else has. You’ve got to be attractive. And so Sam work that out early in the phase and I just stayed I had children I had three kids when I worked for Sam and it was until I wanted to work a bit more because I had my daughter and went back four weeks later on a Saturday. I took the breast pump to work with it.

Tim Reid:
That’s it?

Lisa Conway:
Loved it.

Tim Reid:
Hamming and cutting?

Lisa Conway:
It was day when someone nearly drank it in that fridge when I left it there that we had to put labels of things but i’d was just like that. You perform and do a good job and he accommodated you. And that’s what a good boss.

Tim Reid:
That’s something. It’s a wanky word but there’s something very authentic about that and being able to bring the press club I saw pink on 16 minutes.Did you see that? We were talking about love photos she shared on Instagram. It’s kinda weird. Well it’s obviously a kind of vest that had gold pressed pump. But the point is Listeners are this is not a breast pump. This is not a lactation conversation. She posted that on Facebook.

Lisa Conway:
Because she’s real. That’s why people love her. She’s absolutely real.

Tell me about that. You love Pink. I can see a bit of pink in you.

Lisa Conway:
I just love the way that she says all this is how I am and I’m going to be the best version of me. And I think if we took that leaf as a person but as a business leader people want to be with someone who’s going somewhere who’s going places and doing things and got a thriving growing business not come in and these are all the things you’re not allowed to do. That’s pretty sad I think.

Lisa Conway:
Yes. You tell it how it is right and that’s what attracted me to having this chat with you. I’m expecting some kind of don’t do this, do that they are all doing that. Because they are all expert. y intuition is there already. But you know there’s not enough people I don’t think out there who necessarily do that. I think as you get older you get better at it. I think that you become comfortable in your skin. I’m 53 but I was always pretty much a straight shooter. And yeah like me I didn’t and I was OK with that. But I think I didn’t find it hard to get people work for me because I made it really clear as to how good it was going to be here you know and what you might find here and especially women like to have a nest of women and have no bitchiness. That’s pretty cool if you can do that.

Tim Reid:
It was pretty hard.

Lisa Conway:
It is hard but you just have to make the rules. I think one of my friends Bruce said two years ago.

Tim Reid:
Is he a hairdresser?

Lisa Conway:
No. No hair. He said you know what I like about you. You think like a man. I said no I don’t think you can say that out loud. You said you just do it’s not overcomplicated. And I think there’s feminine energy in masculine energy but I think we get caught up into the motion of everything. Mean if you just put emotion aside and then make a really good decision. And the same with divorce. You could put emotions aside like I’ve had friends who’ve taken three dining room chairs and he’s got three. What do you got with three. Who comes in three? They sell more.

Tim Reid:
So, Lisa you are 16 years working for the man working for Sam. You love him. You’ve learned a lot from him. Did you know at the time that you were just building this treasure chest of business knowledge in order to one day start your own.

Lisa Conway:
No not at all. I decided I didn’t want to drive anymore because I was in his bad and I did a 45 minute drive down to Melbourne so if I was going to do that every day, that’s just too hard. So the GST was coming in and there was people folding who had hair salons who thought I’m going to have to count money for the government I got to do this. And so it was a bit of a clearing sale and I looked in this shop that it closed down. It was a salon and when I looked in there someone looked back and went. Can I help you a bit more. That one’s been taken. And then he said up the road there’s a couple of empty ones. So my intention was to have a salon of just one and I thought I’m over it you know sorting out all the things that Sam couldn’t be bothered to sort out. Customer care was slipping and he really couldn’t get any more and so I just want to work on my own and then I thought if the kids can come after school we’re good. So I put the salon well halfway in the salon because there is lot of back room. We pulled that out and moved it right down to the back 12 months later because it just took off. People wanted to come to me and I suppose I had real good city hairdressing skills and I had this really good country. Make you feel good. Yes come in at a town.

Tim Reid:
That was your intersection?

Lisa Conway:
Yeah and that was just what I did. So I put someone on. I started in the first of the first of the first.

Tim Reid:
Did you want to talk about OCD?

Lisa Conway:
And I think my red was a hundred and seventy box.

Tim Reid:
111 dollars.

Lisa Conway:
A week? 111 dollars. Not good with numbers. We’ve got to make it easy.
And I just put on a team member in another one another one and then I had it for nine years and I started and finished nine apprentices in nine years which is unheard of. People find it really hard to train people today. I didn’t not just treat them like kids. Behave yourself or I’ll give you a wacko. And it just took off and I loved it.

Tim Reid:
You make that rolled off your tongue then business ain’t that easy.

Lisa Conway:
Well it was for me and I think when I look back now and I was I had a second business in the city it wasn’t as easy. No.

Tim Reid:
What was that? Not a salon.

Lisa Conway:
And I didn’t work in that one so it was harder to get it off the ground when you weren’t there all the time.

Tim Reid:
So that’s interesting now we’ve got a benchmark. We can do a split test here. So you got 2 salons. You opened at the same time?

Lisa Conway:
No because I was leaving the country to come and live in the city.
So I sold the country and bought a city one.

Tim Reid:
So the successful ones in the city.

Lisa Conway:
In the city. Much easier because everyone knows your business. right. You don’t even have to market yourself.

Tim Reid:
So the fact that you weren’t there

Lisa Conway:
In the city one.

Tim Reid:
It doesn’t bring a lot of hope, does it?

Lisa Conway:
No because you’ve got to get in there and get started. And then once you do then you can step back a bit but you need to get in and make sure it’s all done. I was already coaching other salons at that stage and look it was good. They advertise it for 30,000 there salon and I told him he could have 10. And then he is a smart arse. I said you know you have to be computer because that’s all it was worth it wasn’t worth anything. I think there was shonky business going on before we took it over as in. There was a lot of musclemen came in. Something was really suspicious there. And so I built it up and we sold it for good money. Two years later. So it wasn’t a flop but it wasn’t like the heart and soul of the one that I was the centre of and then worked my way off so it was kind of different.

Tim Reid:
You were working in the one in the country.

Lisa Conway:
I worked my way off the floor. I stopped working on the floor probably about three years before I sold it. So I just ran it with my mouth.

Tim Reid:
So what you what you mean by that is you work on the tools?

Lisa Conway:
No.

Tim Reid:
For the last three years. Were you in there doing things?

Lisa Conway:
No. Didn’t need to be. I had reception in a so run by itself.

Tim Reid:
So, I want to find out what you did and what other business owners can do both in sell on land retail land generally. But first, it is a fascinating industry and I want to find out because I’m guessing you’re a coach now to hairdressers and salon owners. There’s a lot of them doing a lot wrong and there’s a lot of work out in our little chat the other week we walk past them and I walk past some salons and the fit out. It’s like a five star restaurant and you just can’t help but you then immediately make the move. They must be making a million bucks. They’re doing well. You’re telling me they’re not.

Lisa Conway:
No. Quite often than not. It’s a real surprise because when we start to work with the salon or even when we pitch to work for the salon what we do is we want to see their I call their traffic. So I want to see how many people come in what do they spend how often they repeat you the sale and sometimes you go to these little shonky bills and you go whoo. Good on you.

Tim Reid:
Smash it.

Lisa Conway:
Smash it down and then you go to someone you think. This is I’m very impressed that they even want me to look thinking it’s a bit hoity toity anything the hell’s going down here. So I call them peacocks. They’re very colourful at the front and blah blah blah and then they turn around the bank accounts all brown and they’ll even argue with you. I say little things that you can do like you could write on the mirror a promotion or something. No not writing on my mirror. Why it doesn’t look good. So you broke your bank account look worse. But they sort of can’t. They’re very visual. And that’s really uncomfortable.

So you’ve got to break that thinking that it’s not an image.

Tim Reid:
A few weeks ago and this year we had Chris Lucas who owns some of the most amazing restaurants in Melbourne. Chin Chin, Hawker’s Haul, Baby Kong Pizza and all those and I asked him a similar question which was there’s no shortage of restaurants and this seems to be a restaurant every corner and most can’t be making a dollar. And he said you’re right some are just lifestyle businesses some are happy to earn a wage. His view was that me too doesn’t intellectually interest him. He needs to create something that special that no one’s done before. Do you agree with that?

Lisa Conway:
Absolutely. You’ve got to have a niche. I say to people all the time when I’m working with them why should I come have my hair cut with you. And I say because we’re friendly and we’re really nice. And anyway that’s it a matter of opinion. So what do you do. And look at the barbers. We nearly lost the barbers altogether. They almost disappeared and now they’ve popped up and you go past them on a Sunday. They’re full of staff.

Tim Reid:
They are amazing.

Lisa Conway:
Yes exactly. Because they are a niche and they’re working it out. And that’s the secret and so colouring niches or cutting only. There’s a chappy in Fitzroy who only cuts curly hair. That’s it. They come from all over Australia.

Tim Reid:
Is it called curlies?

Lisa Conway:
No it’s called Neil loves curls.

Tim Reid:
That’s unreal. It’s like 135 or something like that for a haircut and may travel everywhere. He’s just a machine. He just loves curls. He trained himself all over the world and he’s just fantastic.

Tim Reid:
It’s a fascinating discussion because niche is scary when people niche I think they’re going to polarize everyone else which I’m not sure I mean Neil would because he got curly hair you’re not going to Neil.

Lisa Conway:
but yeah but he is audiences far and wide and so what he does is he works with a person who can’t find that care anywhere else. Like even my curly hair people would come to me from other hairdressers with salon and see Lisa and I’d say you did come from and I sold this across the road said me because I don’t know how to cut curly hair and then I got interested because I have a head of curly hair. I was interested so it can be that can be blow waving and it with a blow wave bars now. So you or colouring people specialize in colouring. So that’s the secret. And someone told me years ago a niche is an inch wide right. And it’s my deep. And that is so true. Look at me solo work with hair and beauty salons.

Tim Reid:
Yeah I love it.

Lisa Conway:
To me. I can be so good at it because that’s all I’m focussed on. I have people come to me who want me to coach them. I’ve got one at the moment. She’s a physio for dogs and she sent me this lovely email and I sent it back. No, you’re not here in beauty. And she came back again and said you know what actually I think you’re wrong Barbara and I said all right I’ll talk to you because she’s really keen and I don’t mind helping someone who is feisty and yet someone like that. So, whether I do or not I’ve helped the old personal trainer but I just think I love the hairy people. I love them because they’re my people. I I made all the mistakes they made as well.

Tim Reid:
So in that inch wide niche and just to be clear are you suggesting that like a tip before a salon or any type of business is consider owning a niche.

Lisa Conway:
Do want your love.

Tim Reid:
OK. So within that a niche has its own language. So that’s great. You can speak the same language. It’s easy for others to refer you because if you’re the cheeky cuts curly hair and that’s all.

Lisa Conway:
And they don’t want to cut it so they send it to you.

Tim Reid:
Send it to you.

Lisa Conway:
Neil sends all these colours down the road and I’ve got salons that I work with now and they send them all to Neil because they want genuine person who cares about another person wants them to get the right thing. So send in there.

Tim Reid:
Do you have a process for identifying your niche?

Lisa Conway:
Well I think it’s pretty easy because it’s what you love. People do what they’re good at. And so they get better and better at it. Let’s say for example you’ve got kids coming in and when they were kids they’re just priced amount. But there’s people who even do niche shoes for kids. And we came across a salon the other day in Sydney and she’s niche her salon and she has just started and she’s fitted it all out for the disabled. She’s got a hoist to lift them out of their wheelchairs and into the basin.

Tim Reid:
And that’s her thing. WOW!. Where is she going to travel from everywhere.

Lisa Conway:
That’s right. And so she’s only just starting to break even. And we want to help her with that because her audience is going to be an organization so people will bring them to you. So she’s got a special room doesn’t look like a salon for kids with autism. Amazing.

Tim Reid:
So, to choose a niche, you choose something you love. What if your love isn’t a preferable thing?

Lisa Conway:
Well you might say that about someone who is going to work with a disability too. But I think he can make it profitable thing. So I think anything that you do should be profitable. It’s like low wage there’s blow wave salons and some of them are profitable because they’re just blow waving. But others that do it fast who work on a rebooking system and have packages and that then it can work. So I don’t know I just think if you really love what you do then you’ll find a way to make it work. You’ve just got to think wider and most people like even in my biz only coach salons that I could drive to. Well that wasn’t going to work forever was it. I was going to run out of that. So now I coach towns across Australia we’ve had a first account in New Zealand so you’ve got to think big and if you have a niche you’ve got to think bigger. So that’s just what happens when niche you start to get really smart about it you get a reputation with it and then people come from far more high. So, if you physically have to touch someone like you do in a salon then that is a little limiting. I agree but if you have things like I do which is education or just need my voice you’ve just got to be able to get to you. You film a lot of content you have stuff that you give to them beforehand so it works a treat.
Tim Reid:
I just want to wrap up niche in a minute. But it is a fascinating topic and so you find something you love. You find a way to make it work. What if there is the hairdresser. What if my niche I’m a hairdresser My niche is colouring and the other salon a few doors down is also colouring. She go on and choose something else. So you just do it better than them?

Lisa Conway
You were you thinking too small for starters. So let’s think about our Indian restaurant.

Tim Reid:
Welcome to my world.

Lisa Conway:
Think about Indian restaurants.

Tim Reid:
Yes.

Lisa Conway:
They’re side by side.

Tim Reid:
Yeah I know it doesn’t sound right.

Lisa Conway:
I know but if you do an exceptional job it would be right. OK. So don’t worry about everyone else just perfect what you’re doing.

Tim Reid:
Right, I’m almost going to wrap this up. No I love it.

Lisa Conway:
I know I’m excited like the world’s full of car do people.. This drives me insane.

Tim Reid:
Glenn Azar said we’re all trying to get to it safely. That was his thing. Gave me a tshirt. Hashtag Not Dead Yet.

Lisa Conway:
Exactly.

Tim Reid:
Have a crack.
Lisa Conway:
Have a crack.
Tell me how it can’t work if you show up and you want to work as you say huh can’t find a stuff. Like I have two things. I have to make sure you’re not going to whinge about how good it was in 1994 because I’m not interested. And the other thing is you’ve got to tell me that what you want and can I help you to do it not how I’m going to work. So when I hear someone has been married three times good on you have another crack instead of married once. Not even going not even having coffee with anyone now. Well how does that work for you.

Tim Reid:
Did you disc 1984 before. It’s one of my favourite years. You’ve been in 80’s.

Lisa Conway:
Just to tips our hair up. Years ago the underground all the women were upside down.
I remember my brother coming from the country to pick me up out of the academy and I said Danny you got to come these five o’clock these there’s 300 women come out. They’re all gorgeous. He is a farmer. He came down he sat in the car. He said well I saw 348 they were ugly. I said What do you mean you go. I did that much make up from there. Here it was sticky. I said I forgot I can that girl. It is in the eye of the beholder clearly.

Tim Reid:
Let’s talk. We’re going to go round the place but let’s now sort of dissect other parts other component parts that make for a successful salon business. Can I just talk retail.

Lisa Conway:
Retail is my thing. I wrote a book on that.

Tim Reid:
What’s it is called?

Lisa Conway:
Your salon retail.

Tim Reid:
You’re clever. Let’s talk pricing Why men’s haircut so much cheaper that women?

Lisa Conway:
Because hairdressers are silly. They don’t have a blow dry. So, a woman generally has a cut and a blower. Well look my Simon used to cut his hair. Women will pay more. In the uber on the way in. The blog said to me you asked where I was going or something so I told him and he said:

Tim Reid:
In life?

Lisa Conway:
No. He said I’m going for an interview for blah blah blah. He worked in a beauty space. So I turned to my right and saw him I thought you probably don’t know me left barely. He said I might make a comeback.

Tim Reid:
So, what’s your pricing advice to salon owner that you’re coaching?

Lisa Conway:
Well I think it’s got a start and I say this to everybody. So for every half an hour he got a charge 45 minutes.

Tim Reid:
45 box.

Lisa Conway:
45 dollars. Sorry. Then you go up from there. So that’s your base. Otherwise you’re going to make any money. So how are people going to pay 10 dollars for a haircut. I don’t know. There’s something dodgy going on there.

Tim Reid:
It’s fascinating, isn’t it?

Lisa Conway:
Well it’s not right and I don’t know why we should shut them down. To be honest. But anyway. And so then four years of service the customer care and you know all the things that you’ve been trained like oh you got a haircut. I had to cut hair at highpoint for 26 dollars for men. When I first started way back in the 80’s you could see really a haircut there. And that’s was that the driver was saying today he said wings wins coffee going to get off three dollars. He said How long is coffee been three dollars eighty? He said 10 years. I said I agree. He said they should be six box. And hairdressing is one of those things that hasn’t gone up. Flights were deira 10 years ago now.

Tim Reid:
Well the price list is elasticity of hairdressing is clearly reaching a point where I mean most blokes aren’t going to pay 50 bucks per haircut. Well I’m sorry we can go to the barber.

Lisa Conway:
Now I know but I also think they you can go somewhere where they don’t give you any advice on how to look after here home so they don’t sell your product. They don’t talk about your scalp. Most bingo ball because they used too many lorrel sulphites in their shampoo. You don’t know about the laurels. Yeah. The Laurels. Bugger’s. And so there’s so much more advice. But you know think of it like this and this is what I say to someone I just like food sometimes I just want a McDonald’s. Other times I want a fine dining with a big glass of wine. What do you want when you want a haircut. I can’t help it if you only want McDonald’s there’s salons for you. But if you want to go somewhere where they’re actually ahead of the curve they know what’s going on. They treat you beautifully like what a haircut can give you is an unbelievable age in confidence.

Tim Reid:
I agree with that.

Lisa Cownay:
So that’s the same as fine dining people don’t care if there’s rose petals on the side of your dish that go on and do eat them. No. Right. Clearly I’ve got five brothers that come down from the country and they said why they put all this shit in the food. So if I said that word but I said it three times prior to that so I’m sure I could. And so I just think Gary what you were wouldn’t you want it. Yeah. Like he just wants to pipe dupes.

Tim Reid:
Let’s talk customer experience. I’m going to guess that’s pretty close to your heart. There is a barber shop that I’ve been to but I haven’t made it a habit of going there. And I’m wondering why. Because the experience they offer is fantastic and they do charge about 50 bucks for a haircut but you walk in. It’s an open bar. You can have everything from Jack Daniels and Coke through to cheap beer. You know it’s part of the deal. You don’t pay for that. You know all the blokes have got tats they’re all looking like this hipster thing. There’s very cool posters as bobbish. It’s just a it is a total immersive experience and it’s ice and it’s all blokes and we’re all talking crap and it’s just a lot of fun. So I get that niche they’re charging what they deserve. I know it’s good experience. So customer experience how do you get a hairdresser who goes. What are you talking about? I’m not marketing as much less customers. How do you get them to buy into that concept?

Lisa Conway:
Well I think for starters the first problem is that they don’t ever buy what they sell. So, I call them vegetarians that work in butcher shops. It’s all wrong. So if you don’t ever buy what you’re sell how would you know what it feels like. So most of them have been in the industry since they left school. They’ve never even been out and had an experience never. And then I get them to go and have it and they go. I couldn’t go well if they muck it up go ahead. Hello. Now you know the customer feels like. So the good salon owners will be going out all the time and having their hair done and they’ll pick up on tips here and there and they know what’s going on they got it. It’s really cool. I like the way they did this or I like the way it led to the Hedon there. You know they’re they’ve got no idea what’s going on. So that’s really sad. So that’s very hard for them to give that experience if they don’t know. And then you’ve got some in the salon probably one the owner who does give an exceptional experience but the others don’t. So that was kind of my problem. I had people who wanted me and it was the least a sparkle that they wanted wasn’t necessarily the haircut. So I had to work on a way that I could teach other people to be so engaging so I won’t be cutting hair and someone is coming to the door with the pram and I leave my client to open the door for the lady with the pram. When the hairdressers are standing there what’s the hell. That’s a customer experience too. You know nothing like Sam taught me short of prostitution. Everything’s possible. That’s what you taught me and that’s what we used to say. And that’s where I learnt that skill to look after people. So he had no problem with that. And then he was just come up behind you. Lisa won’t be long. I think it got him way and cut faster. So there’s a whole generation who take their time the artists.

Tim Reid:
You can flick your eyes back.

Lisa Conway:
So people want a good service but they want it in an incredible short amount of time. No one wants to spend three hours in a salon. If you could do the same colour and take an hour and a half. I think it’s worth twice the money.

Tim Reid:
OK. So come back to all this for a customer experience so you first of all you tip was go and buy what you sell and do it often.

Lisa Conway:
And do the same. Get people into your place and critique your team members do.. What’s your front door experience like were you offered to rebook. Were you offered styling tips on how to manage your hair in between you know same as beauty treatments. You know they do a beauty treatment and the next day they complain because they will ring up because they’re red in the face. So I go with what he explained and this is going to happen. You could have pictures so they don’t think about what a customer doesn’t know. They just because they know it. They think everyone knows that there aren’t many clients ringing me up.

Tim Reid:
So part of this customer experience is the fact that you’ve got everyone wanted the least a sparkle. And then you’ve got all these other staff who don’t have the lease. How do you how do you get people to buy into what you do. You just lead by example.

Lisa Conway:
Well you teach them you’ve got to make time to work on your team and then people want to train their people in skill as in technical skill that’s only part of it.

Tim Reid:
It’s like that’s learned.

Lisa Conway:
Well I think he can learn that. But if you teach people to give a shit and care then they will do the skill properly. And I was an average hairdresser I was an exceptional hairdresser. I was an amazing people person. That’s what won me all of us. And that’s what you have to teach people. So you do teach them to let’s just what you do expect that you’re going to teach someone. So if you find good people you can teach them the skill. But what they do is they chase skill and then expected to teach someone to be a good person that’s never I’ve never seen that work yet. So I had great success with finding good people who want a great boss and I was a great boss when I left the country salon to go to the city and I thought well was going to know who I am. So how am I going to find staff. Whereas in the country was easy because people go to work. If you’re serious if you want a good place to work that’s your take no shit. So that was mine. So every one of them wrote down all the reasons why you should work for me. And I was blown away that the single thing that came back was she’ll call you on your bullshit.
It’s a great place to work. There’s no bitchiness. Treats is all equal. Everyone apprentice to the senior. And that’s what they loved about me and at times of them being a bit harsh here. But you know we had a magic door when you walked into the door was called a ship shaver. If you’ve got a bad attitude I’d just grab you by the shoulders and I come back he laughs. I go it. They shave brush it off. You come in. Made you laugh. It is a nice way of saying to people you know this is an Ireland. So when you come into work all your troubles get left behind. Isn’t that a good place to be. So no matter what’s gone down in your life come work here. It’s a great place to work. And if you start to talk about things you just put your hand. Don’t tell her. If we were going to say anything negative I had to take you out the front of the salon to have us if we were going to talk about a client who is driving it’s insane we’re in line to talk about in the salon. You just say come out at the front.

Tim Reid:
It feels to me like I can’t agree with what you’re saying but there will be business owners that you work with who have highly give you the most amazing haircuts ever. But you’re telling them to pull their staff out and put their hand up and give them a shit shave and take them outside and it just might not be part of their DNA.

Lisa Conway:
But I think if you’re going to lead a team isn’t that what running a business is about. Then you need to learn this. If you don’t learn it you’re just going to change your style or your manner sounds we come across it got up to five or six on time and then ended up back to none again. Why is that. Because there was no honesty in the business there was no this is how it’s going to be. No culture no core. So therefore it’s going to fall over at any point.

Tim Reid:
I imagine the hairdressing industry be full of people who go and start working at a salon a freelancer or friends but then they go Oh I reckon I could do this myself. So
I was a multiplier effect.

Lisa Conway:
Yeah they do and we don’t have that much trouble in beauty. Beauty you’ve got a cost it costs a lot of money to open a proper heavy duty beauty salon. But hairdressing it doesn’t cost much. But then I just think the customer experience has got to change where if you go to one sale there’s only one or two people in there. Then you’ve really limited to your choices like I want to go to a salon where she’s great she’s great he’s fantastic he’s awesome she’s great and I got choices. You know imagine going to get your coffee going nice not here today. No coffee. So it’s about you have to be a leader. That’s as simple as that. And I don’t care who you are, what business you’re in, if you don’t know how to lead a team and paint a picture of what’s wonderful in the future and where we’re going especially this generation. They’re very different.

Tim Reid:
Don’t get me started I got three of them.

Lisa Conway:
I think they’re fantastic. How old are yours?

Tim Reid:
17 19 and 21.

Lisa Conway:
Mine are twin boys 26 and a daughter 27 so yeah. So I’ve raised them to stick up for themselves.

Tim Reid:
I am talking to Lisa conaway’s She’s from Zing business coaching hairdresser was an ex-hairdresser a country girl made good. We’ve been talking marketing everything we’ve been talking about has been marketing but when you sit down with the salon owner and say write out what marketing you’re doing. Do they kind of glaze over.

Lisa Conway:
No. Because they want to do marketing that’s where they say oh I just need more customers want to market and I go oh how long you’ve been in business. Eight years ago would you do the ones you had. What do you mean. I go home a lot. We got you know 80 people come through the door every week having new ones 20. And then you’re still on 80. So clearly killing the same amount as you’re getting. Yeah. And they think so. And one of things we make them do is you’ve got to look at the names of the people who didn’t return for months. We give them. Someone hasn’t returned for months. They’re somewhere else. So before we teach marketing we can teach you some in-house ones. But before we teach marketing we want to tidy up the customer service and get everything right first because when you market it’s like shine the light on me look at me as a business. So if you market before you’ve got things tidied up you’re going to grow cancer grows too. So you’ve got to be careful about that. So some of them we lose accounts because they just want marketing I think we’ll go somewhere else. Fine. Just marketing. But we do the whole enchilada. That’s what we do. So marketing to me I think they don’t understand it so they think it’s like doing other packs. Something like that well I think that’s probably even moved on or they put things on Facebook and they put a post on Facebook or wonder why it doesn’t work and so I go all social media is not for that it’s about gathering a tribe and giving value back so giving tips and how to look after your hair and what skins like and all of those sort of things so I don’t think they understand it for starters to me the word marketing is just repeating your story again and again no matter where you go. And people often say oh we just do word of mouth or that just tells me you’re lazy. How to do it. So you can do word of mouth on steroids by doing a referral card or things like that so it makes sense to refer people who already know and love you and trust you they know who to pick for you. So there’s lots of things like that but marketing it’s really fun.. I love it. But I think that you’ve got to understand it before you can start it.

Tim Reid:
I don’t think enough business owners see it as fun. I know it’s amazing.

Lisa Conway:
It’s like a net you know we all got one.

Tim Reid:
As long as you know what need to pull out. Yeah.

Lisa Conway:
And you know to get the odd boot you’ll get your boot that’s fine. But I think it is simple I say to people that everyone who comes to your salon they’ve got to go somewhere else. Just ask everybody. Do you like that restaurant or do you go to the yoga studio. Where else do your customers hang out. And you can ask just casually and find out and just keep a little list and then you go to those people. So if you’re beauty only go find a hairdressing salon near you and do a cross pollination thing you know a florist I did it with a dry cleaner.

Tim Reid:
Partnerships.

Lisa Conway:
Yeah 50 blow waves for free top 50 accounts in they come. So people who have dry cleaning there will be fussy. So they have the hair done. It’s not that hard.

Tim Reid:
Not hard. That’s a partnership strategy.

Lisa Conway:
Florist people who are spending over 100 dollars in a florist for someone they’ve got money and they’re the ones I want. So it’s about finding those kind of people I loved it and was until I got off.

Tim Reid:
That’s just a game.

Lisa Conway:
Just like a game.

Tim Reid:
Who else got my customers?

Lisa Conway:
Roll the dice and I get two sixes.

Tim Reid:
Correct.

Lisa Conway:
You know who else has got my customers? But what they do wrong is they come into your business and they go can you put these are really sheepish can you put these on your counter. And you know my hairdressers would say yes and I’d come and go but she did. Yeah. They go oh she’s there to know what to say. I turn them over the first thing I’m really happy is if there’s nothing on the back they make really good notes for the grocery store. So I would say to people when you do marketing put something on both sides because that’s what I do. So if you do that then why would you do that. If I’m going to partner with you. I’m going to take you out for a coffee I want to talk to you first I might send you a letter saying this is who I am I wouldn’t send a letter I’d do a little video because that works for me. You go sticky notes you’d have a look that’s who I am and what I want to do. I want to help you in your business and maybe you can help me back in mine. It’s not hard. It’s fun but if you got your head down in your bum up cut in hair all day we’re going to fit this thing.

Tim Reid:
So to that point, do you then get your clients to put aside a dedicated amount of time to do their marketing?

Lisa Conway:
Half a day a week.

Tim Reid:
I love it.

Lisa Conway:
So you got it it you got to find four hours phone off TV off kids tied up somewhere for hours a week. If you can find four hours a week uninterrupted and I say even in those four hours you’ve only got to find 45 minutes for each hour but if you concentrate for 45 you get a lot done by 30 minutes. But think about might be the first session might be to ring five of your people that you think he could synergized with easy.

Tim Reid:
Or 10 clients who haven’t been back for four months. That would be a gutsy thing because you don’t want to hear oh god somewhere else.

Lisa COnway:
That’s business. You put your hand up to be a business owner. Hello. The rewards are exceptional. So but you got to put in. But it. I remember the first time I sent out my first lot of lost clients I’d gone back over 12 months or so and I had these 300 letters made and I literally hung onto them in the post box. I was scared because I thought everyone would think gosh she’s desperate now. And they just came in and just said hey I haven’t seen you for a while we’d love to see you again. That’s it. No not. Did we hurt you. Did we shit you. They just came in with these 30 dollar vouchers and it was 30 dollars for cut and colour and they came in said I’ve been thinking about you. I thought I’d come in. So what it did was it gave them let them know that I’m happy for them come back. It was not that no one’s lying awake thinking about your business.

Tim Reid:
Correct. You’re the owner is.

Lisa Conway:
You think about how many businesses you lie awake thinking about it. Not that there’s some hot like it that you know I you at the jump. But other than that you’re not.

Tim Reid:
Correct.

Lisa Conway:
So get over yourself ticket I said it all the time.

Tim Reid:
Well good advice. Clients paying a few hundred bucks in your life mate get yourself ticket. There you go. I love your work. I love the fact that you are helping business owners like us who are really struggling with this stuff. They are stressed.

Lisa Conway:
In fact most of my clients have little families. I hate that. You should be able to come pick your kids up from school.

Tim Reid:
There must be. Just to finish up. Is there a moment you can reflect on because you must drop value bombs every time you get in front of a business so much more. You can see these people. You were there decades ago right. And then you dropped this little value bomb maybe this time sometimes we.

Lisa Conway:
We make them cry all the time. I think you get a change at home. Some say it nicely when you get a change out of emotion. So you’ve got to be excited. The only way you’ll change is if you’re angry or excited or happy and you just tears of joy. Right. But if someone comes to me they might have a crack at this coaching. No I say you got to be excited and nervous. But like when you find out you’re pregnant thing. Now I’ve got to get it out in my.

Tim Reid:
It’s so exciting.

Lisa Conway:
That was exciting. Now you think I’m going to get it out. It’s nine pounds.