338 – The E-Myth’s Michael Gerber on how to go from a company of one to an enterprise of 1,000

338 – The E-Myth’s Michael Gerber on how to go from a company of one to an enterprise of 1,000

Michael Gerber scarcely needs an introduction, however, if you haven’t heard of him before he is the Author of the small business classic The E-Myth and he has just published his latest and last book Beyond The E-Myth

This Michael Gerber interview explores why the vast majority of small business owners are on a fool’s errand.

So, he’s on a mission to turn them from a bogged down company of one, to an absolutely brilliant company of one thousand.

How’s this for a scoreboard, since The E-Myth was originally published over 20 years ago it has:

  • Over 5 million copies sold
  • In 2011, The eMyth was named the best selling business book of all time
  • Sold in 145 countries, translated into 29 languages and taught in 118 universities
  • Sold in 145 countries, translated into 29 languages and taught in 118 universities
  • INC magazine calls him “The world’s #1 small business guru”

[Tweet New book Beyond The E-Myth being released by @MichaelEGerber at age 80! #Machine]

Michael has a dream to transform the state of small business worldwide. He’s been doing that for the last 40-years, and now (at age 80) he’s about to launch his newest book titled Beyond The eMyth.

But that’s not all. In this episode of your favourite marketing podcast:

We cover plenty of ground in this chat including:

  • What’s missing in the way most small businesses are run?
  • How Michael stumbled upon the world of small business and some of the back story behind his books
  • How to go from a company of 1 to an enterprise of 1000
  • And the hierarchy of growth to get to 1000
  • I share another low cost marketing idea for you to implement immediately in our new segment loving called What Have You Got To Lose?
  • And we revisit a past episode in which I spoke to Siri, the REAL Siri Karen Jacobsen.

Yep, you guessed it, another big episode, so let’s get stuck, right in.





00:00  Two marketing insights
00:45   Teaser
01:24  Welcome & overview
04:02  Today’s guest introduction – Michael Gerber
05:54  Interview with Michael Gerber
58:10 Insights into  WebCentral & DesignCrowd
01:00:10  My Top 3 Attention Grabbers from my chat with Michael Gerber
01:01:54  What Have You Got To Lose? #4
01:06:55  Wrap-up and an insight in to both a past guest & next week’s guest





  1. Read The E-Myth! After you’ve read the E-Myth read Beyond The E-Myth. They should be required reading for all small business owners … and their children!
  2. Start with a blank Canvas. The idea of sitting down and asking yourself what your New Co. would look like based on Michael’s E-Myth model sounds like a worthwhile exercise.
  3. Have a dream. To start with the end in mind is a good thing. I’ve got a great interview coming up with the owners of Canberra Airport, all about starting with the dreaming and working backwards to make the dream a reality.





Michael Gerber’s official website

The E-Myth Book 

Beyond The E-Myth

What Have You Got To Lose? – Add Live Chat To Your Website

Check out Zopim, ZenDesk, FreshDesk to get started

WebCentral’s Online Conversion workshops
October in Sydney and Melbourne – use promo code TIMBO16 for 10% discount





WebCentral – Exclusive listener offers
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What was your biggest marketing learning or ah-ha moment from this episode?

Leave your comment below.

My guest and I respond to each and every comment.


25 thoughts on “338 – The E-Myth’s Michael Gerber on how to go from a company of one to an enterprise of 1,000”

  1. Hey Timbo,

    Yes you are right, I will have to listen to this episode again. But not because of all the gold in it. Instead, more so that I can actually understand it, as I got very confused in the middle part of it.

    I was doing alright until we got to step 5, or was it step 1 of part 2 lol.

    So I will definitely go back and try and listen to it again, and will also be getting his new book when it comes out in audio format.

    I didn’t really agree with him on his point towards the end, that YOU should be getting a second and third Timbo to do your talks. (That’s if I understood him right)

    If he came to Melbourne then I would make the effort to go and listen to him. But if he sends one of his staff, no matter how good they are, to Melbourne to talk, I don’t think I would go.

    Don’t get me wrong, I certainly get his point, but I just don’t think it can apply for every single business, especially ones that are all about that one person who is the speaker or actor or whatever it may be.

    Can I also say Timbo, well done on adding those questions at the end. I think they really threw him, and he was not expecting them at all, and because of that, I don’t think he will ever forget the interview he did with you.

    And after going through the whole system and I’m sure many people like me got lost in there and will be listening again. I like the fact that you ended on a funny note, which perfectly fitted in with your brand. So well done mate.

  2. Great feedback, Benny. Thanks buddy. I know what you’re saying about not showing up if Michael wasn’t presenting, or if I wasn’t presenting. But therein lies the challenge to create business systems, training, etc that attracts other good people to present the same information equally as well. Millions still buy a Big Mac despite the fact that one of the Crock brothers isn’t making it!

  3. David Patterson

    Another great episode Tim. Just finished listening to Tom O’Toole and thought it could not get any better – listened to that one twice over a couple of days. Drove to Melbourne today from Warrnambool and listened to this interview on the way down. Then listened to it again on the way home. I think i could pinpoint the moment where you went – “oh yeah”. I had to pull over on the way home to write down the notes. Systemising my accounting business from the operation through to the marketing is now on my list of must do’s. Starting with the blank page to design the perfect and replicatible accounting business is high on my list.

    One thing – could not see where I could actually purchase the book.

    Great work Timbo. This one is now in my top two of your podcasts.


  4. Thanks David. Yes, it’s certainly one of those episodes that requires a second, maybe third going over. You can grab some preview chatpers of Michael’s book at http://beyondemyth.com/ – It offically launches early December 2016. Cheers Timbo.

  5. Matthew Young

    I agree with Ben on this one, people buy from people. You can clone a big mac, but you can’t clone people.

  6. Best interview I have ever heard with MG. I was actually on one of the first ever podcasts hosted by Michael. This was over 15 years ago! This man has had the biggest impact on my business then anyone. I read the E-Myth 12 times! What can I say…I’m a slow learner. Love this stuff. I want to go into the Dreaming Room. Who’s with me??

    Thanks Timbo for pursuing this one and asking great questions.

  7. You guys are missing the big picture here. It’s all about a system. I used to think my business couldn’t be simplified. Take a step back and look at this from a different perspective. I have successfully added sales staff to my business. Are the as effective as me? No, but if I can get them to about 80% as effective, I have a salable model. There are good people everywhere, just like Michael said. The hard part is building the system. He is 100% correct!

  8. Timbo one of your best ever already on to listing to for a second time. The dream room is awesome cant wait to get in there and i have the E-myth book at home guess what i will be reading again this week?? This is just the kick in the bum to finish off my systems as well.
    Timbo keep up the great guest & content Thanks Shaun

  9. Paul Farina

    Very inspiring. This was a reminder of how much I limit myself. Cheers Timbo!

  10. Thanks Shaun. Glad to be of assistance. I’m actually heading over to The Philippines in two days to put in place a service that helps businesses put in place systems once and for all. Go for it!

  11. Hey Tim, This is a good episode.. Its classic Michael Gerber (the message has generally remained the same for many years)… For those that have not heard Michael before, its full of great stuff! For those that have heard him before or read The EMyth then it reinforces a consistent message! I’m now on the waiting list for the new book… Thx!

  12. My pleasure, Rport. I love the fact that Michael’s message has remained so constant. There’s good learning alone in just that.

  13. Ok… So I wanted to post a second message to discuss the “What Have You Got To Lose?” segment… This is quickly becoming my favorite segment!.. In this episode, you promote the benefit of “live chat”.. Well I did it! And the results so far have been amazing… I did it for different reasons.. (1) we have a number of unified inboxes for email such as support@ team@ sales@ accounts@, etc.. What I was observing that traditional email is terrible at managing and coordinating customer communication & support. The result was that we started to use http://intercom.io as a unified inbox instead of email.. intercom.io also lets us do other things as well; (2) website live chat; (3) twitter DM chat; and lastly; (4) FB messenger live chat. All of these are in one unified location… The benefit is that EVERYONE in our organisation now has a comprehensive view of open conversations and commitments we have made to customers… I get amazing statistics and HAPPY customers!

  14. Signature Clothing

    Loved this episode Timbo.
    I really resonated with Michael how he has shifted (not changed) his thinking up to another level, adding a holistic vision to business.

    We all agree that systems make a business run smoother, it creates a better customer experience through consistency and makes a business saleable.
    No better example than our friend Nick May has proved is possible.

    But when you add the ‘dream room’ ideas to your base, real possibilities open up.

    One of the all time top episodes!

  15. Signature Clothing

    Actually been in there for a while now, just wasn’t sure how to describe it.
    My dream centers around getting some people (both employee & outsource) to do the things I either don’t have the time or skill set to do that will take our business forward and free me up to do the skills I’m really great at.
    Using Michael’s teachings, we only need an incremental improvement to achieve a substantial result.

  16. Great discussion here, sorry I’m late! (I’m so behind on my podcast consumption!)

    Couple of things I picked up, some things don’t make sense, some are wrong (because I’m wrong) and some things that really stood out.

    1. I understand the need to create a saleable business, a SYSTEM that you can sell yet still be part of. But the challenge is when it’s your name on the business as mentioned on some earlier comments. Dick Smith and Michael Hill Jeweller are two examples that come to mind (is the latter still a thing there?). Both are/were selling “things”, and they both had systems to push and advertise and ultimately SELL those “things”.

    If you have a personalised service like mine (http://www.NickLogan.co.nz) and perhaps like Timbo has with the speaking gig, you can not replicate it. You can’t replicate personality. Tony Robbins to my knowledge hasn’t tried to replicate his on stage persona, yet alternatively you can attend Jeffrey Gitomer workshops that Jeffrey Gitomer isn’t actually part of, instead his personally trained and structured clones present his ideals. The difference? You can’t teach experience.

    2. I absolutely LOVED hearing Timbo “get it”. I’ve never heard the pause and the tone of voice from Timbo as the penny dropped – it was great to hear and something kinda rare in the interviews. That’s real cut-through.

    3. I think this was covered, but I think it is easier to sell a business if you start the business with that in mind. Many of us have stumbled along and created a brand that can’t be sold. Rebranding is fun though right?

    Thanks Timbo! Great episode!

  17. Some great comments and observations here, Nick. Thanks buddy. Re finding other people like us may sound impossible but I do think it’s possible. Whilst they don’t need to be mirror images of us (impossible), if we can find others who give audiences the same outcome then we’re on to something. And that, me thinks, comes in training. Am I about to do it? Nup. But having spoken with Michael, I do think it’s a valid business model.

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